# Columbia VS NYU?



## bombshellfilms (Feb 18, 2009)

i'm curious from those who have applied and those who are going to these schools currently. what are the pros and cons of each? here's an interesting article about it: http://www.1918film.com/info-columbia-film-school.htm. 

would love any input.


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## dragynally (Feb 19, 2009)

I think b/c they have very different philosophies it is difficult to make a side by side comparison. Columbia is more storytelling and learning producing directing and writing all at the same time. NYU has more of an experimental of filmmaking....feel free to correct me on this one.


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## bombshellfilms (Feb 20, 2009)

thanks for the input. i have heard similar thoughts. can i ask what you mean by "experimental of filmmaking?" you mean experimental film or experimenting with film technique?


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## dragynally (Feb 20, 2009)

From what I understand experimental has less linear or storytelling...its more about images and camera angles...I could be wrong


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## d_lefeb (Feb 23, 2009)

Bombshell, check your PMs.


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## duders (Feb 23, 2009)

> Originally posted by dragynally:
> I think b/c they have very different philosophies it is difficult to make a side by side comparison. Columbia is more storytelling and learning producing directing and writing all at the same time. NYU has more of an experimental of filmmaking....feel free to correct me on this one.



This is absolutely false. NYU is ONLY about personal narrative filmmaking. Experimental works are not encouraged at all. In fact, most people that do experimental films are told to go somewhere else.

Of course, people are encouraged to work experimentally in terms of cinematography, editing, sound and structure. However, at it's core is always a narrative.


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## dragynally (Feb 23, 2009)

Duders thanks for clearing that up...as I said this is only what I've heard. In that case I have yet to see a clear difference btw the programs.


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## bombshellfilms (Feb 23, 2009)

dragynally, at NYU do you feel that you have been equally trained both as a screenwriter and director? what are the strengths of the program for you? weaknesses? if you want, PM me. i do understand this is more about the individual's needs and how they match up to the program, but it helps immensely to gain perspective from someone who is currently experiencing it.


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## dragynally (Feb 23, 2009)

I think you meant to say that to Duders. I don't go to NYU


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## duders (Feb 23, 2009)

the stereotypes about Columbia vs. NYU are this:
Columbia produces better writers, NYU produces better directors/DP's/Editors/Producers

I'll be honest, I don't know much about Columbia's program, but from what I understand, it's a shorter program (2 years+thesis at Columbia, 3 years+Thesis at NYU). And it's more writing intensive.

At NYU you will learn every aspect of filmmaking, you will DP, record sound, edit, produce, be a gaffer, grip...pretty much everything on set. So in that sense, NYU is known as being more 'technical'. Some may see this as a waste of time. However, the philosophy is simple: if you know all of the technical aspects, you will be able to make stronger decisions as a director and storyteller. You will be a more complete filmmaker well versed in all facets of production.

As a result, the first year of the program is very production heavy (you direct three short films). The second year is a mixture of writing and directing. The final year is very writing-oriented both for writing a feature and writing a good thesis.

As for freedom as an artist, there is no doubt in my mind that you will be artistically satisfied. There are no taboos, you can make any films that you want to make. All professors are there to help you achieve your vision. The department wants your films to represent YOU as an individual. People are free to explore any idea or genre that they choose. In my class there are people heavily into horror, comedy, neo-realism, film-noir, gay/lesbian and any other genre or non-genre. Experimentation is encouraged.

Honestly, no one cares what your movie is about, as long as it's good.

I have worked on a few Columbia shoots, and the DP's are usually NYU students building their reels.

If you are at all interested in cinematography as a trade or just storytelling technique, I can say NYU beats Columbia.

From what I understand, their writing program is better.

However, I think NYU produces better directors.

Ultimately though, it's about you as an artist. If you are sure you just want to write and focus on that alone, I would say Columbia would be better.

However, if you really want to direct films, know how a complete production works and become a well-rounded filmmaker, you can achieve this at NYU. 

Take what I say with a grain of salt, this is just from my limited experience with Columbia and a lot of experience with NYU. 

Perhaps a Columbia student can give a better impression.


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## BillyD (Feb 23, 2009)

Whoa, hold on there, folks.

I can't speak for NYU at all, but let me clear up this last post:

At Columbia, you work in all crew roles.  You don't direct 3 short films the first year, you direct 6 or 7.

And in my years here, I've never worked on a shoot that had a DP from NYU - all were from within the program.  Although, I'm sure it's happened.  And I will say cinematography is not Columbia's strength.

I also absolutely disagree with the idea that Columbia is for people who only want to focus on writing.  Just look at the films - shorts and features - that have been accepted into Sundance over the last decade or so.

Additionally, I find the suggestion that NYU is the only place for people who 'really' want to direct films and become well-rounded filmmakers absurd.

For future readers and applicants, I can only recommend that you be extremely wary of those who post opinions of schools that they've never attended.  Because, in reality, no one really has any idea unless they've been there.


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## dragynally (Feb 23, 2009)

BillyD: Thank you for writing about Columbia. I am applying there and its nice to learn more about it.
Duders: thanks about clearing up the points on NYU.

Most of my thoughts on both programs comes from research and stories. So its nice to get the inside story.


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## color soup (Feb 23, 2009)

I think it's safe to say that neither university provides a quality education.


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## Suzako (Feb 23, 2009)

color soup,  I assume you mean "either", right?  Because "neither" is pretty harsh, haha.


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## color soup (Feb 23, 2009)

I was joking


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## Suzako (Feb 23, 2009)

Ah, that ole thing: a joke!  That's what I get for reading the forums late at night and at low brain capacity!


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## d_lefeb (Feb 23, 2009)

Hey duders... Like BillyD, I am a current Columbia student and I can vouch for everything he just said (although I have never seen an NYU DP on any shoots, I have met some craigslist DPs. Mostly though, it has indeed been Columbia students). 

I would also like to add that Columbia is all about "storytelling technique". Sure, NYU has better equipment and probably better DPs, but in terms of telling the story with images (not just pretty images), Columbia is not too shabby, let me tell you. I learn so much every week in my directing class, it's crazy.

Also, I'd like to give a shout out to Columbia producers. Because everyone in their first year does writing, directing and producing, I feel we have very adept, competent, understanding producers in the long run.

Finally, saying that Columbia is mostly for people who only want to write is quite wrong. Each year has about 65 students. Usually, about 45 of them will be directing concentrates.

And yeah, I'm pretty sure Columbia students will agree that we know how a complete production works 

Cheers everyone!


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## hoohaProductions (Feb 23, 2009)

Hey, for you current NYU and Columbia students (and any other current grad students, for that matter...), what are your prospects looking like for after grad school?

What's the plan of action for breaking in to the industry? Or are you flying independent? Have you made any significant contacts? How important will your alma mater be in determining where you go next? 

I'm curious, and I hope I'm not hijacking the thread. It just interests me.


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## bombshellfilms (Feb 24, 2009)

all great info from everyone! to d_lefeb, duders, etc... did you have film experience going into grad school or was all this new?


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## duders (Feb 24, 2009)

d_lefeb & BillyD,

Thanks for sharing and clearing things up. Admittedly, I don't know much about the program at Columbia and am clearly biased in one direction.

I didn't have any experience in film before grad school. 

As for prospects after grad school, I don't think it's the job of the school to help you in any way. I used to be pissed off that NYU has very little resources in helping their students move into the industry. Now, it doesn't bother me as much. Ultimately, it's up to you to figure out what you want to do next.

Maybe it's best that you try to get into the Sundance Labs, or direct a micro-budget feature. Maybe you just want to teach? Maybe you really want to edit or shoot other people's work.

The point is, it's really up to you to work on your own behalf. You will meet so many people at school that you could always get jobs crewing on films. Is that what you really want to do? I find that it's best to turn down jobs and focus on writing rather than lose days of unproductivity.

An MFA from one of the top film schools does not guarantee you anything. However, it does almost guarantee that people will give you a chance. Maybe they will read your script, or maybe they will watch your short. So no one will give you a job because of your degree, but they will give you a chance, it's up to you to back it up with good work.


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## kiernanbyrne (Feb 24, 2009)

This is a very informative thread. Thanks all!

-K


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## d_lefeb (Feb 25, 2009)

Obviously duders, BillyD and I are biased too


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## Jayimess (Feb 25, 2009)

D, how's the program?

I'm so glad to see cats from other schools here, and I gotta say, after all the "flame" wars we've had between two California schools over the two years I've checked this site, the NYU-Columbia dialogue was so grown up!  Yay for you guys.


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