# The Poor Kids Club & Film School



## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

Okay, so this is for people who have only themselves as financial providers. How did you make film school work the first year? On the US Dept of Ed site, grad students can only borrow up to 20,500 per year. NYU and Columbia are this much per semester. I've looked into several scholarships. Any info from current students would be great.


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## jthamilton (Mar 13, 2009)

Good topic, bombshell. To answer your question, I've known people who take out private loans on top of government loans for school. Not sure how hard those are to get this year, but they are definitely the safest type of loans for lenders since you can never discharge them with bankruptcy or anything. I know that, in general, the advice on this site is pretty gung ho "you can make it work, you only live once" kind of stuff with regard to taking on loans for film school. But I'd be interested in hearing from people who chose a less expensive program over an unaffordable one, or people who have calculated what their monthly loan payments will be once they get out (is it manageable?), or even people whose parents are paying who are willing to say "yeah, my parents are footing the bill and that's how I can do it." I've spent a lot of time wondering what happens to the people who take out 100k+ in loans after they graduate.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

Well I'm not going to be paying for EVERYthing.. if I get in... but I will probably be paying for most of it.  My parents are supportive of my decision to go to grad school.  But I mentioned one day, "hey.. you guys know I only applied to private schools, right?"  and they were like "  ".  I applied for financial aid and my plan is to pay for the rest in loans.  I haven't officially asked my parents how much they'll put in, but I'm guessing it'd be about how much it would cost if I went to a public school in CA, which is much less.. but they already paid for my undergrad education and I get tired of mooching off them.  I would love to be financially independent.
I'm trying to think of it as an investment, but I will definitely have to pay off loans for the rest of my life, and I'm starting to regret only applying to private schools, starting to realize just how much money $60,000/year really is.  If I don't get in this year, maybe I'll apply to public schools next year.  CA resident prices are pretty good.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

jt - thanks for the response. it's a hard subject. private loans, that's right, they are an option although i'm curious if those are being given out with the economy the way it is. i spoke to the financial aid department at the small private college where i work and their opinion was, "no way, not now." those loans are also dependent upon a good credit rating and well, mine isn't great. i do agree with the "you can make it work" mentality although when it's only up to you, it's a bit scarier. are you currently in school?

tabby - being financially independent is all well and good but if you have the opportunity to get help, i'd take it.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

Oh, also, expenses will be beyond tuition, fees, etc. Have to think about living expenses (rent in LA and NY - yikes) and production costs which I am assuming are all out-of-pocket and not included in the schools' breakdowns of expenses?


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

Some schools provide those numbers - the $60,000 I got is AFI's estimate of first year expenses, but their tuition is "only" $35,000 of it.  I do think their estimates for rent and misc expenses could be lower for me, since I figured out my rent for a year and it was less.  I think most schools have a page where they give you an estimated cost of everything per year, and its pretty scary when you realize that almost half of it is NOT tuition..


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

haha. "only." wow. is AFI the most expensive?


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

I don't know, but it's definitely up there!  
I think most private schools are ridiculously expensive.  Not to say they aren't worth it.  When I was at AFI their campus was so beautiful, I remember thinking, "oh, this is where all that money goes "
But you can definitely get just as good an education at a place like UCLA where it's (as far as I remember from looking it up) significantly cheaper.


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## Jayimess (Mar 13, 2009)

The $20,500 is for Stafford loans, then there are the PLUS loans, which will be the bulk of your debt.   These are government-ish, but you still have to have decent credit...not good, just decent. 

I don't know anyone who does the private loans.

Living expenses are by far the bulk of what I'm borrowing, the tuition estimates they gave at USC were far higher than what it actually was.

There doesn't seem to be Pells or anything for these programs, because I haven't gotten any of them.

Just loans, loans, loans.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

Yeah, I think the fafsa people told me I wasn't eligible for a pell grant, not sure why though.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

jay - thanks. yes, i've seen the info on plus loans. 

i suppose we're just all going to have to become ultra-successful directors and writers and pay it back quickly.


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## Sonia (Mar 13, 2009)

Here are cost estimates for USC. For tuition, I believe all School of Cinematic Arts programs are billed per unit rather than with a flat fee. And the unit cost for SCA is slightly higher than the base price””it's $1329.

According to the SCA website, Stark people have to take at least 44 units to graduate. Writing: 44, 46, or 48. Production: at least 52. Please correct me if I'm wrong, Jay!

My parents aren't pleased with my aspirations to work in the film industry, but, to my great surprise, they're going to help me pay for school. They also paid all of my expenses at my private college, minus a $5K/year academic scholarship. I've only been independent from them for about a year, since I got my first full-time job””and even so, I'm still covered on their health insurance plan. Man, do I feel spoiled.

I sent my mom an estimated cost breakdown, and she's going to get back to me with a dollar amount that she and my dad are willing to give me. I understand how you feel about mooching, Tabby. I'm just going to accept their help and show my appreciation as best I can.

Part of the reason my parents want to help is that they (my mom, at least) are terrified of loans. I think they've only had 3 in their lives, and none were very large except the mortgage on our house. The way my mom talks about them makes me a little scared, too.

I completed USC's financial aid app earlier this week, so (according to the website) my aid package should arrive in about a month, and I'll find out what kind of loans I need to take out. Since I filed my FAFSA as an independent student, without my parents' financial data (which is different from what I did in college), I have no idea what to expect.

I hope to get a work-study job or find a part-time job off-campus, although I want to wait a semester for an off-campus job so I can get into the swing of things at school first.

Thanks for starting this thread! I'm interested to know how everyone else plans to work this out.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

> Originally posted by Sonia:
> I sent my mom an estimated cost breakdown, and she's going to get back to me with a dollar amount that she and my dad are willing to give me. I understand how you feel about mooching, Tabby. I'm just going to accept their help and show my appreciation as best I can.



Yeah, I think this is what I"ll end up doing if I get in.  I KNOW for sure they can't afford to pay for my whole education, what they're paying per month for health insurance is ridiculous, and I'm not even on their plan, so I know they have a lot of expenses of their own to take care of.  I did my undergrad in the UC system and got some financial aid too so it was much easier for them to pay for my education back then.  I'll accept whatever help they're willing to give me but I know for sure I'll have to take out loans.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

Oh yeah, and I was pretty excited for once to not have to put my parents' info on the fafsa, because I'm pretty sure I made less than they did last year. We'll see if that helps me out at all..


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

jay - were you able to get everything in loans? i'm assuming this included the PLUS?


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

So, I'm interviewing for UCLA, which costs, as near as I can tell, a fortune for out of state.  If I don't get tons of financial assistance, though, I'll have to decline even if I get accepted.  I've been on unemployment since October of 2007 (thanks to many extensions), and can expect exactly no help from my family.  

My parents weren't a huge help with undergrad, either, so I've been mostly deferring and forbearing my loan payments since graduation, save for that one year where I actually had a job.  So I'm already packing a 25k debt, and somehow it's not comforting to know that I'll be at least tripling that unless I get some scholarship action.

That is, of course, unless I don't get accepted at all.  Hard to believe that 50k or more in debt IS the bright side.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

notrob - i'm with you. i have undergrad debt, too, but i really have to look at educational debt as an investment. and we just have to make sure we bust ass post-grad school if we do get in.

also, the first year, i'm understanding, is the hardest. it's easier to get scholarships once you're in.


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

when you look at what people get paid if they actually do make it in the business we're all trying to get into, a hundred grand doesn't seem all that enormous.  I mean, WGA minimums for a script sale with a budget over 5 million is around 80 thousand right now...  

It's not the repaying I'm worried about so much as the getting-enough-to-not-starve-and-go-to-school now part.  I'll borrow, work, or take charity as much as I have to to ensure that I can afford school, housing, and food.  If that leaves me swimming in debt... well, that's pretty much par for the course as someone trying to make it in the post boom, debt riddled country we've been living in for the past ten years or so.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

notrob. haha. your dryness is refreshing. well, then, let's just see what we can do anyway we can do it. can you get loans to cover your living expenses? jay (posted above) mentioned he's getting loans to cover that and i will have to do the same since i make right now what my bills are. and i won't be working (unless it's work-study) during school. does UCLA have TA programs?


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

I'm afraid I don't know very much at all about what my situation will be.  I don't know about TA positions or if I will be able to float a massive amount of loans to cover my living expenses.  I haven't even interviewed yet.

I do know, though, that if I don't get accepted AND get enough money to survive then I'll be passing on the opportunity to attend this year.  Worrying about that definitely makes me worry a lot less about the interview itself.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

Okay, so this is for people who have only themselves as financial providers. How did you make film school work the first year? On the US Dept of Ed site, grad students can only borrow up to 20,500 per year. NYU and Columbia are this much per semester. I've looked into several scholarships. Any info from current students would be great.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

right. my friend keeps telling me i can't make a decision yet and have to wait to see what the offer is if there is one.

i'm confused, though. what do you mean if you are not accepted and get enough money? did you mean accepted and get enough money? then you still won't be going?


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

I mean, if I get accepted but I don't get enough money, then I can't go.


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## jthamilton (Mar 13, 2009)

I've spent a lot of time ruminating on the comments on this New York Times blog. 

http://news.blogs.nytimes.com/...-loans-dont-pay-off/

Culinary school seems to have a lot of parallels to film school, and some people actually talk about their film school debt in these comments. Not to be a negative Nelly, but I have a friend who is simply unable to make her loan payments on 60k student debt. I can only imagine having over 100k. I've applied to a variety of places, including smaller schools known for having good aid packages and interviewed at most of them, and now I'm waiting to see what if any offers come my way. 

I have definitely decided not to go into more than, say, 20k worth of debt over the life of the program (figuring I may have to finance some/all of my living expenses), so if that means that I can't attend any program, I've pretty much accepted that.


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

maybe I'm just an egomaniac, but I don't feel like I'll have a problem "making it."  I've already seen some pretty significant interest in one of my scripts, and with film school and an MFA on top of that...   well, I think I'll be sitting pretty as far as paying back loans goes.

So I'd rather go pretty deep into debt and come out in the above-described position then have to refuse the networking and discipline-having opportunities that film school provides because I'm unwilling to take on the debt.  

And even if I'm wildly overestimating my own future success, I suppose I'd rather go for it and fall on my face then always wonder, yeah?


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## jthamilton (Mar 13, 2009)

But didn't you just say that if you don't get enough money you can't go?

Also, I think pretty much everyone who takes on that kind of debt feels that way. Not to say you are wrong about your future earning potential. Just that everyone feels like they will "make it" and few do.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

Depends what you mean by "make it", though.  It's funny, because I use that term all the time, and then someone will ask me, "make what?" and I won't know what to tell them.  It's a pretty intangible thing.  Of course, if you're talking about being the next Spielberg or -insert big moneymaker here- then you're right, very few make it.  But if you mean getting your script made into a film (if you're a writer), getting it into festivals, earning some kind of profit, then that's much more doable.

for me, I think it's being able to edit TV shows, or edit trailers for big movies or something, and being able to live comfortably off that without worrying about finances.  It's definitely possible if you put in the work.  It's about being realistic about what "making it" means, and still being happy if you're not the next spielberg but you're still doing what you love.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

Oh.. but I forgot we're talking about paying off huge debt... like I said, I'll probably be paying back loans the rest of my life because I don't necessarily expect to make enough working on one film to pay off the entire thing.  I figure it's just something you live with like your electric bill or phone bill, only it's bigger.

Alright.. I don't think I helped at all


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

If I don't get enough money from somewhere, I can't go.  I meant that even if I get accepted, I won't be able to attend if I can't get enough money to support myself (tuition, fees, housing, food, etc...).  

However, I will take out every loan in the book before I turn down an acceptance.  I am considering all scholarships, loans, paychecks, and thefts as a means to get enough money to attend, and if all those things still leave me short, then I will have to politely decline.    

where my boat differs from others here, is that most people either A) only want to take on X amount of debt (jthamilton being one, I think) or B) can expect some sort of help from family.  I have nothing coming from the family, but I also don't care about limiting my debt if that can be the difference between going and not.  That makes three boats, of which I'm in boat C.  (Boat Seven Cs, if given the option of naming my boat.)

P.S. I'm not sure how insane that last bit comes off.  If it's "very," I apologize.


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## jthamilton (Mar 13, 2009)

I see what you're saying, nrt.

Ok, I just found this loan payment calculator online. I ran a pretty simple test case, just to see how it turned out.

http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml

So take 2 years at AFI at 60k including tuition and living, assuming no help from parents or tuition remission from the school. Now maybe you do get a little scholarship money, but maybe you also end up going to a 3 year school and paying for your film costs, anyway, just to come up with an amount to borrow, I picked $120k. Based on estimates I've read, this doesn't seem unlikely. 

So I plugged this in to the debt calculator at the current federal interest rate for student loans (6.8%) and even assumed no loan fees. (There always are some, but I didn't know how to estimate, so I just said 0%)

Payments over the standard 10 year repayment: $1381/month. Just like another electric bill, except, like, $1200 more.

So say you stretch your repayments out to the max--30 years. Well, then your payment drops to $782. But it's over 30 YEARS. And you end up paying back a total of $281,631. That's 161k in interest. I just don't see how this is reasonable for anyone but the independently wealthy.

Ok, I'll stop my responsible parent thing now. I just don't know how people expect to make $1400 loan payments. I totally bought a lottery ticket yesterday for this very reason.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

jt - good to be a parent, but can't let that stuff stop you. i'm not trying to be annoyingly positive but we all have chosen a field that is more difficult and sometimes, you have to blindly move forward and just believe in yourself. it's a big risk, but we all know that going in. you deal with the consequences when they come. 

also, on a more logistical note, there are payment plans that work with you and gradually increase so you're paying a smaller amount first and then it increases over the years.

so we can either all throw in the towel now and never know or move forward and at least have a small chance at making successful careers. i vote for moving forward.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

> Originally posted by jthamilton:
> Payments over the standard 10 year repayment: $1381/month. Just like another electric bill, except, like, $1200 more.



Holy cow!!!   It's good to be positive but it's also good to know this kind of stuff.  I was just going to wait and see if I got in at all before I researched any of this.


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## KayS (Mar 13, 2009)

Okay, so I know/knew nothing about financial matters.

I did have to choose a cheaper undergraduate program and went to a state school, which I am now happy about because I can concentrate on just grad school being uber-expensive (also its a shorter term, 2-3 years, so less debt incurred).

That being said, my parents have footed the bill for me my entire life, even after graduation when I quit my job in NY because it wasn't going to get me what I wanted out of life. I feel really spoiled but I always keep in mind the support they give me despite the fact that they are not uber-rich. (Sorry, I will continue to abuse the word uber. Try not to let it bug you.)

But recently I read these books Rich Dad, Poor Dad and Increase Your Financial IQ both by Robert Kiyosaki, and by no means does that make me an expert. I'm just starting to get my feet wet, but reading them has changed the way I think about finances. I don't know how to do it yet, but I'm searching for something that will generate a steady cash flow for me to help pay for tuition. Something like real estate, where you get that cash flow from renters every month. I haven't figured out how to get the money to invest in real estate, especially with the current economy and banks unwilling to loan, but that's my goal--to either learn more about real estate investment or to find other investments that will generate cash. 

In the meantime, I'm determined to accomplish my sort of unrealistic goal: I'm writing a book and hoping to get it published eventually to have that generate at least SOME cash flow. I figure it's more likely than selling a script since there is a larger market for books. I could be sounding very silly and wrong right now, but I'm still going to try.

Otherwise, if the banks don't help, my parents will be giving me a zero-interest loan, which is nice but not what I would love, especially because I want them to retire whenever they want.

Your Seven Cs boat is very clever, nrt.


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## KayS (Mar 13, 2009)

Oh, also, Sonia, where did you get the supplemental form for USC's financial aid? Did they send it to you in your acceptance or did you get it after sending in your deposit? I'm wondering if I missed something in my packet or if I just haven't received it because I haven't sent in my deposit yet.


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## tabbycat (Mar 13, 2009)

I feel that way too, that I want my parents to be able to retire whenever.. my dad is in his 60s and is still working   The more money I ask them for the more years he'll have to work...


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## notroberttowne (Mar 13, 2009)

As to making it:

Sure it would spectacular to set some sort of unbreakable oscar record for screenwriting or be so successful and revered that thirty years from now someone on a forum calls themselves notmyname, but that is above and beyond the call of "making it."

Making it is being a working screenwriter.  Making it is getting a sale or a commission about every six to eight months or being a staff writer on a TV show.  Making it is being able to write for TV or film for a living; having a good life without copious financial concerns based only on the income writing generates.  

My brother is in law school, and he would love to some day sit on the supreme court.  Will he consider himself a failure, will he claim that he has not made it, when he graduates and goes to work for a prestigious firm?  Absolutely not.  When he graduates, he'll be pulling in an excellent salary and doing what he wants to do, and that's all he needs to feel he's made it.  He doesn't need to be Spielberg, and neither do I.


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## Justin18 (Mar 14, 2009)

Well, hopefully the MAJORITY of film school educations can be financed by loans - Stafford, GraduatePLUS, private, whatever.  Because I, like many others, ideally would like to count on scholarships and personal savings, but these can only go so far.

Kay, I really benefited from the RDPD series as well. At least in changing my mindset, if not in changing my actions...yet   I picked up the original one in a Scottish airport's bookstore on my way home from a study-abroad stint there in college. 

I mean I think that most people on this board have similar objectives - to have a strong impact with their films in some area - socially, artistically, financially, a mixture of those, etc. And that's a mindset you should never give up on your entire life.

That being said, the economic realities of pursuing a film career for 95% of the people doing it can mean that you'll live at a lower material standard than you might have been used to growing up. 

I read that many guild sitcom writers make just $35,000 a year.  And if you write for a sitcom, I mean that's sort of considered making it if you're into the Hollywood scene and television writing, right?

But I would dare to say that this salary level is pretty common for the majority of editors, directors, actors, production designers, writers, etc. in mnay different media. 

I would assume salaries in the film world mirror the current economic distribution of wealth in America. That is, if you're in about the top 10% bracket, you'll be doing quite well. However, if you're in the other 90%, you'll be living an everyday struggle. At least by the industrialized world's standards.  Money will be tight. 

So yes, going to film school probably implies that you take out loans equivalent to a 30-year mortgage on a cheap apartment.  

But in order to pay those loans off, like Kay said, you have to develop Robert Kiyosaki-style additional income streams in which you leverage your own time and money to make money off of other peoples' time and money. Might sound harsh, but that's capitalism, you lose unless you use capital. I mean that's what's being done to you if you "work" for the "industry." You're just someone else's financial leverage. 

I don't think it's realistic to think that a person graduating from film school will be able to live a comfortable middle-class lifetyle only off of their craft. 

I think most people have to supplement their writing/editing/directing work with 
A) teaching 
or
B) developing a business -  be it a production company of sorts or something outside of the media industry such as stocks, real estate, or another type of business.

Like right now, I'm spending half of my working hours teaching English as a Second Language, and half of it writing. Or "trying" to write and staring at my blank page and coffee shop customers.  It's tough, becuase I only get to spend half my time doing what I really wanna do.

But I expect to be doing the same thing after grad school. That is, to spend 1/2 my time teaching or working to improve my financial life.  And to spend 1/2 my time at my film craft, in my case writing.

I will have to be on my guard in grad school not to lose touch with the business side of things.  Becuase I see that happening with my other friends in grad school now.  It's as if they think "ahhhh, I'm in a 2-year playground where all I have to do is study, and my loans are supporting me just fine for now.  Hopefully, when I graduate, I'll get a job." 

I don't want to be that person. Because I know that for film, just "getting a job" after grad school won't even be enough to pay off my loans and pay rent at the same time. I'll have to be really creative with employing myself and developing additional sources of income.   

With all of my heart I hope I can "make it big" in a way that I have personally defined. But at the same time, I'm very conscious of the time and financial realities of going into this trade for the majority of people.  It's a tough pill to swallow - I think about it everyday and wish it weren't so and then have to tell myself to accept it and keep going. But I guess there are sacrifices with anything you do in life.

Sorry for the long post


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## Suzako (Mar 14, 2009)

> I read that many guild sitcom writers make just $35,000 a year.



This number seems extremely low to me (less than a starting NYC public school teacher?) and not in line with other things I've read.  

I'm not saying that you should assume you'll be rolling in the dough.  Obviously not (why else were the writers guild striking not so long ago), but a cursory glance at the minimums for staff writers on the WGA site makes the outlook a little brighter.


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## Sonia (Mar 14, 2009)

Kay””
I got an email from the Financial Aid Office on Feb 25 (a week and a half before I was accepted). It said "additional information is required in order to process your 2009-2010 financial aid or loan application" and told me to go to  usc.edu/financialaid, click on "My Financial Aid & Documents," and download and fax the supplemental form (which asked for info about the program I was applying to and the number of units I expected to take per semester).

I think everyone who checked the "I want to apply for financial aid" box on their application got this email””not just those who were accepted.

If you didn't already send a FAFSA to USC and apply for financial aid, you should just go to the website and do it as soon as you can (although the deadline is May 5, you might receive your aid info sooner if you fill it out now). All of the forms are there, and the whole process didn't take very much time once I got all of my financial info together.


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## KayS (Mar 14, 2009)

Sonia, thanks SO MUCH! I don't think I ever got that e-mail, but I'll check out the financial aid page and fill those forms out. At least I already filled out my FAFSA...


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## notroberttowne (Mar 14, 2009)

WGA Guild Minimums

Here are the guild minimums as of February 2008.  It's dense and lawyery, but it makes it pretty clear that if you're a working guild writer making only 35,000 a year, you're either not writing much at all or you have terrible luck.  A TV writer making minimums and writing two episodes a season (which is the norm according to Pamela Douglas's book) would be pulling in 43,000 a year for episodes and outlines, and the same amount in residuals for the virtually certain primetime rerun.  That's 86 grand, not counting any reruns beyond the first or DVD sales.  

Which is still not such a haul that ten grand in loan payments is easy, but it's definitely easier than making my three thousand dollar loan payments earning ten grand a year.


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## bombshellfilms (Mar 13, 2009)

Okay, so this is for people who have only themselves as financial providers. How did you make film school work the first year? On the US Dept of Ed site, grad students can only borrow up to 20,500 per year. NYU and Columbia are this much per semester. I've looked into several scholarships. Any info from current students would be great.


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## duders (Mar 14, 2009)

Alot of people at NYU are living off of their wealthy parents. 

The poorer students usually have federal loans, supplemented with scholarships and private loans.

The poorer international students don't qualify for federal loans, so rely on scholarships, loans from their home country (whose maximum values pale in comparison to NYU tuition), or private loans. 

An email was sent around recently, about Citibank not offering their loans to international grad students. All international students should take note. This will definitely affect a lot of international students. It could be a serious problem.


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## tabbycat (Mar 16, 2009)

I'm starting to doubt whether or not I want to be in so much debt for pretty much the rest of my life... but I don't know if I'm actually second guessing my desire to go to grad school, or if this is some defense mechanism softening the blow for when I don't get in.... but then if I do get in... wow my own mind is so confusing


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## Ryandbc (Sep 4, 2009)

I've had to turn down Grad school acceptance for not getting enough loans in the past.  It's painful stuff for folks that don't have the enchanted pedigree to come up with the cash =P

Lucky enough my BA from a not well known school has been good enough for plenty of jobs.  Most people I've found could care less if I had any degree to begin with.  That said I'd love to be able to afford a program.


I guess it all depends on how life turns out.  I mean I've worked with rich kids that did the NYU thing - and had no problem, due to no debt, parents paying for living costs for years so they could take low paying but rewarding projects/ fund their own projects.   

I also worked as an editor with a guy who had gone back to school a bit later in life, from a poor background - and was pretty much screwed.  We were making really great money - and he still could barely keep his head above water.  He had loved school though as a break from reality.

It just all depends.  The odd thing though for me is that my most successful friends have not been big time film students.  I have friends making very good livings in LA - own homes, are in their respective unions, and working on massive projects - all from my small state school video program.    And then you have the kid with an MFA from nyu, stocking shelves at the store my dad was an assistant manager for in CT.

If your poor - it's up to you if you want to roll the dice on those loans.  

Make a couple short film, get some work written, save some money and get a place for a month or two in NYC or LA - and work.  After that now see if you think it's worth it or not =).  Hell half the jobs out there you can get just by showing up - my DP friend has tried to get me to switch to LA for years, lamenting that sprucing up my oldish demo was a waste of my time since nobody probably would bother to look at it anyhow for mostjobs...  And if you think you can make a film, then make it.  MFA's are def good to teach tho -and sure great experience  for the wealthy crowd.  One day if I could make it work so I wouldn't be in over my head, I'd love to go and don't knock anyone for doing so.

My 2 cents.


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