# BEST FILM SCHOOL BY STATISTICAL SUCCESS RATE APPROXIAMATION FOR DIRECTING



## lemcaution (May 19, 2011)

From a student in a "top 5" MFA film program.  I got a Math Phd friend of mine to calculate a "success" rate for the top 5 film schools FOR DIRECTING AWARD WINNING FILMS.  School: NYU, USC, UCLA, AFI, COLUMBIA

Given, there are some assumptions being made here (I only know the specific details of the MFA program that I am enrolled in), however, I think the approximations are close to accurate, please chime in if you know the numbers to be wrong.  

The success rate is based on the amount of student academy awards won per each programs class size over the course of the last 15 years.  GOLD, SILVER, AND BRONZE AWARDS ARE COUNTED.  because each school has won gold, silver, and bronze at one time or the other, we grouped them to try to approximate the most "awarded" school hoping that all the different levels of awards reflect different levels of film's success.  Obviously the student academy awards do not exactly represent "a real success rate" or the schools rates of having films in top festivals, however, its the only numbers that are available and still provides a good indication, I think.  

The schools were split up into the awards into 3 categories:

1.  Narrative.
2.  Documentary.
3.  Experimental.
4.  Overall.
5.  Without Documentary.

The reason why the animation awards were left out is because they represent a different part of each film school and not the general PRODUCTION/DIRECTING programs that are being judged.  

Methodology: The success rate is calculated by taking the total number of students over the last fifteen years and dividing it by the number of awards resulting in a decimal approximation of the success rate per each student. The same methodology is applied for each category.  The success rate is listed then the number of awards over the last fifteen years, in parenthesis.

Here are the result

NYU

36 students a year. 540 total students over the last 15 years.   

        TOTAL  NARRATIVE  DOCUMENTARY  EXPERIMENTAL
RATIO:   0425   .025         .003         .012
AWARDS:  (23)    (14)         (2)          (7)

UCLA

18 students a year.  270 students over the last 15 years.


         TOTAL   NARRATIVE  DOCUMENTARY    EXPERIMENTAL
RATIO:  .0185     .011           0          .007
AWARDS:   (5)      (3)                      (2)

COLUMBIA

48 students a year approximately 8 of these are screenwriter only and 40 are either directors or screenwriter/directors.  Approximately 600 students over 15 years.  

          TOTAL  NARRATIVE  DOCUMENTARY  EXPERIMENTAL
RATIO:   .0233     .010        .008         .005
AWARDS:   (14)       (6)         (5)          (3)


USC

100 students each year, approximately 40 of these students are directors or do graduate directing films.  Degrees are given in "production" not specific areas ie directing, editing, even though students do concentrate in areas of discipline. 600 Students over 15 years. 


          TOTAL  NARRATIVE  DOCUMENTARY  EXPERIMENTAL
RATIO:    .02       .006      .01          .003
AWARDS:   (12)       (4)       (2)          (6)

AFI

28 Directing fellows.  420 over 15 years.

          TOTAL  NARRATIVE  DOCUMENTARY  EXPERIMENTAL
RATIO:    .009     .009         0            0
AWARDS:    (6)       (6)


So,
based on the ratio of awards to class size, The "Rankings" are as such:

NARRATIVE:
1. NYU: .025
2. UCLA: .011
3. COLUMBIA: .01
4. AFI:  .009
5. USC:  .006

DOCUMENTARY
1. STANFORD - I didn't calculate it but nothing compares, they have won twice as many documentary awards and have half as many students...
2. COLUMBIA:  .008
3. NYU:  .003
4. USC:  .001
5. UCLA:  0
6. AFI:  N/A

EXPERIMENTAL (Many of these directors often do both narrative and experimental films and go on to direct "story" narrative themed films. This statement was assumed by IMDB'ing all the experimental film winners and seeing their following type of work)

1. NYU:  .012
2. UCLA:  .007
3. COLUMBIA:  .005
4. USC:  .003
5. AFI:  N/A

OVERALL AWARDS FOR ALL THREE CATEGORIES

1. NYU:  .0425
2. COLUMBIA:  .0233
3. USC:  .02
4. UCLA:  .0185
5. AFI:  .009

OVERALL AWARDS WITHOUT DOCUMENTARY (Often documentary is a separate department)

1.  NYU
2.  UCLA
2.  COLUMBIA
4.  USC
4.  AFI

It's surprising how NYU almost outperforms the other top school by almost two to one, and the others are very close to each other.  Wish I had known this before I had made my decision, may have been worth the extra money to attend NYU after all.  Oh well hope somebody enjoys this.


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## Mike_V (May 19, 2011)

I'm still a firm believer in your success coming from your ability to create a film that captivates the audience. 
You can throw statistics at anything, but in the end, it's the work of the team that makes the movie.
Not to say your statistic means nothing, but just that it's not a definitive factor of getting you where you want. I've met people who go to the top 20 business school in the country and I wonder how some of them even survived high school with the sheer idiocy or laziness that some of these people have. On the other hand there are those are deserve to be in these schools because they work so damn hard to be there.

it is an interesting read though.


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## lemcaution (May 19, 2011)

You're absolutely right and i totally agree, in fact, I'm not a huge believer in film school at all,  Just wondered it when I was applying and I thought others may too.


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## Mike_V (May 19, 2011)

Well, I wouldn't go and say I'm not a believer in film school since I'm currently at Chapman, but I do believe that it is your drive to create a story that makes a film not the school. School is there, imo, to allow us to be able to create films and form a communications link to the industry as well as getting into the industry.
The most important thing for me that worked with film schools is that the professors here are willing to teach and will give you their all if you make the effort to give it to them. I can confidently say I'm a much better editor than I was with the help of my professors and peers and practice in a constructive environment is what makes it so effective.

I would also like to note that there is a difference between east coast and west coast film school as well. East coast schools tend to push for the avant garde or the indie style film while the west coast usually go for something that is marketable to the general public. This is in no way saying that east coast films are not marketable, but it is not meant to cater to the general public. THe west coast style is most often made with money making in mind as well as general entertainment rather than a statement.


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## robot_m (May 19, 2011)

Just curious, what happens to the numbers when the sample period is reduced to 10 years? 5?


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## lemcaution (May 19, 2011)

I can find out, but I think the only change would be Columbia may be 2, UCLA may be 3, not sure though - probably for 10 years, not for 5 though...But i'll figure it out and post it


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## JacksonFilms (Jun 9, 2011)

Now, just for fun, add in the tuition and cost of living expenses.


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## Wheaty (Jun 9, 2011)

Lemcaution,

It's a huge leap to say that Student Academy Awards = top film school.  I like where you're going here but your conclusion is faulty.

Assuming your data is correct, your analysis could be used to predict a student's likelihood of getting a SAA trophy but I think you have to be careful when drawing larger conclusions.

Best,
Wheaty


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## Jayimess (Jun 9, 2011)

Art is not a science.  Success comes in different packages than Student Oscars.


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## Mike_V (Jun 9, 2011)

> Originally posted by Jayimess:
> Art is not a science.  Success comes in different packages than Student Oscars.



Now I wonder why this forum doesn't have a +1 button here...


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## L@la (Jun 27, 2011)

Awesome that you took the time to calculate this. I hope it helps folks decide.  
As an AFI fellow, I must say a lot of it doesn't apply to us, since we do only narrative films at AFI. We don't have documentaries or experimental films, so that should affect the overall total. 
And just as an FYI, an AFI directing fellow got a student academy award this year. 
There's a whole lot more to finding out whether a school is right environment for you than awards, but it's great to know that someone has recognized students for their hard work, regardless of what school they go to.


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## solojones (Jul 2, 2011)

> Originally posted by Jayimess:
> Art is not a science.  Success comes in different packages than Student Oscars.



Yeaaaah, this also kind of assumes that everyone who goes to film school wants to direct because these are awards for overall films. But there are thousands of times the number of non-directors in the film industry as there are directors, and most of the people who aren't directors don't want to be. Besides which, no one gets hired to direct a feature because they won a student Oscar anyway.


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## jackgradus (Jul 6, 2011)

> Originally posted by JacksonFilms:
> Now, just for fun, add in the tuition and cost of living expenses.



ahahah, so much columbia hate.


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## jackgradus (Jul 6, 2011)

also, no matter what your statistics may say, I only applied to UCLA and columbia. UCLA's dvd was ****. I am sorry, not a single one of the shorts in there were worth anything. The writing was horrible. the values even worst. Columbia's DVD, on the other hand, was amazing. The hirosaki Players, in particular, is one of my favorite shorts ever. None of them were weak in any glaring ways. 

Now, you can argue blah blah blah about cost and benefit analysis but then I start to wonder whether you should be getting and MFA and should instead just go for an MBA and stare at excel spreadsheets for the rest of your life.


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## Chris W (Aug 19, 2019)

lemcaution said:


> From a student in a "top 5" MFA film program. I got a Math Phd friend of mine to calculate a "success" rate for the top 5 film schools FOR DIRECTING AWARD WINNING FILMS. School: NYU, USC, UCLA, AFI, COLUMBIA





lemcaution said:


> OVERALL AWARDS WITHOUT DOCUMENTARY (Often documentary is a separate department)
> 
> 1. NYU
> 2. UCLA
> ...



Stumbled across this fascinating old discussion today. Thought it'd be interesting to bump it up and see what people think nowadays.


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