# USC Critical Studies vs Chapman Production???



## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

My son has been accecpted into the Cinima-TV Critical Studies program at USC (Production was his first choice) and the Film Production Program at Chapman. He got good scholarships at both schools. USC was his #1 choice, and he's now torn because he would be in Critical Studies if he went there. If he went to Chapman, he'd be making films, not just learning about their history, but USC is his "dream school". Do any of you have an opinion about the Critical Studies Program? Would it be worth going there for that, if film making is the goal? I would appreciate any dialogue on this subject. (He also applied to NYU, but hasn't heard back yet)
Thanks!!


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 18, 2007)

I'd suggest Chapman. USC is good, but so is Chapman, and a cinema studies program will be severely disappointing to anyone who wants to be a filmmaker.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

Do you think there is any value in a degree in Critical Studies? I know there are some production classes in it, and it would be a good degree to have to go to grad school. Do you know anything about the actual USC program?


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## Dumb Liberal (Mar 18, 2007)

Is it possible to transfer from cinnema to film later on in the year?


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 18, 2007)

I don't think a filmmaker would be at all happy in critical studies. A real film program is much more suited for filmmaking. I can't argue that strongly enough.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

His ultimate goal is to be a Hollywood Director, so putting off what he want's to do now, to reach that goal is acceptable. What is your take on getting into grad school if he goes through Critical Studies first? What are your thoughts on Grad school vs undergrad film programs and the success afterwards?


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

And Yes, he can try to transfer into the Production Program at a later date, but I have no idea what the success of doing it is. He will call the school and find out if he is on any kind of wait list.


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 18, 2007)

Well, one thing to consider is that grad school is very hard to get into. If he didn't get into USC's undergrad, who knows what his chances for grad are. Also, many filmmakers don't go to grad school. This is a very fast, and very competitive industry, and the success usually goes to those who get there first. I feel that if he wants to direct, he should be directing now.

Chapman is a very good filmschool (arguably the best in America right now, based on resources and policies) and is kind of the "new kid on the block," with brand new facilities and equipment. As soon as NYU and USC realize how much competition Chapman represents, they're going to panic.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

What do you believe is the one best way to become a Hollywood Director? (If you had to chose a single way)


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## Winterreverie (Mar 18, 2007)

I was reading UCLA's ten year plan and they are already beginning to panic about Chapman. However, to play devils advocate-- USC is so well known in the industry, the alumni connections are fantastic, and the education they give is more suited to industry filmmakers (as opposed to Chapman or UCLA which tend to groom more independent filmmakers. Your son could always go to USC and change majors as the faculty get to know him-- thats not at all unheard of in impacted programs like the film school.


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## ajadler (Mar 18, 2007)

the critical studies diploma at usc says the exact same thing as the production diploma, but your son will lack core production classes and experience on set if he goes in that direction. chapman is a very good school for production especially with all the new resources they have. he could get a job on set quite easily with that.


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## ajadler (Mar 18, 2007)

also to transfer to production at usc you must wait until second semester of sophmore year.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

Does anyone have any idea of how difficult it is to transfer into the production program from Critical Studies?


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

I pretty much agree with what you've all been saying. It makes sense to me that he goes to Chapman. But, he is more interested in big budget movie making vs Indie films. He is afraid that missing the oportunity to get into the program at USC would be a mistake. He doesn't want to go to Chapman and then regret not going to USC. My fear is that he'll go to USC in hopes of transfering, and then be stuck in Critical Studies. (Plus the fact that even with a half ride scholarship, we'd still have to come up with $30,ooo a year.) In all honesty, I'm not really sure what the Critical Studies program is really for, unless you want to be a film critic or go on to a masters program.


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## Winterreverie (Mar 18, 2007)

If he wants to go to SC, let him go to SC, there are plenty of private scholarships to apply for outside of the university one. I do think he should visit both schools however. because if he truly has his heart set on USC then he won't be happy going anywhere else, plus if he really wants to do production he will make it happen once he's there. I went to USC Briefly in undergrad and the community and campus was really great and offered so many opportunities to get involved even if you weren't focusing on film (at the time I was a Theatre student. But it all comes down to how much he likes the school as to whether or not he will thrive there.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

We visited both campuses this fall. Chapman first...liked it, a lot. Then USC...blew his mind. His heart has been there ever since. I'm just afraid that he will let that emotion distract him from his ultimate goal. I've been reading all of your responses to him, and we've had some really great discussions. I really appreciate all your feedback!


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## Palm Tree Armada (Mar 18, 2007)

I wouldn't be discouraged by getting into the critical studies program- that's still one heck of an education in film. You can learn a lot about filmmaking through studies. You won't get the hands-on experience necessary, but anyone can work on student projects no matter what major. Remember that he'll still be going to the School of Cinematic Arts at USC, so he'll have many of the same opportunities as the production students. 

Transferring is probably difficult, to be honest. Don't worry about having to wait until 2nd semester sophomore year, though; no one at USC takes any sort of production class until then anyway.


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## Winterreverie (Mar 18, 2007)

Besides... and not at all to sound judgmental, I found for myself and so many undergrads after me, those first few years of college you're defining your ultimate goal beyond what you grew up "wanting to be". He may walk in there wanting to direct and walk out as an architect or  a business man. A campus that makes you happy goes a long long way. I work in a Dean's office at a medium sized college in So. Cal and can't tell you how often students change majors or add double majors for that very reason.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

You all have given some great advice and thoughts. Thank you!

If you were my son, knowing all that you know, and what I've told you, what would you do at this point?? Chapman Production or USC Critical Studies?


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## Jayimess (Mar 18, 2007)

Personally, I would attend Chapman and if he's unhappy, he can attempt to transfer to USC Production from another renowned production program.

There is no formula to being a Hollywood director, but someone who needs to make films no matter what  should be making films.

If he wants to go to USC just to go to USC, be in LA, be a Trojan, party, whatever, then he should go to USC.  

It's a question of what he really wants from his college experience.


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## ajadler (Mar 18, 2007)

i would say chapman based on the fact that it is an up and coming film program and by the time he graduates, it'll be pu there with usc and nyu as far as the industry is concerned. studios will know by then what chapman students have to offer, and he should have chances close to usc or nyu of making it.


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## Winterreverie (Mar 18, 2007)

I would go to Chapman for the film school and USC for the school itself. I think thats a big deal in undergrad. 

Since I am past that phase, and want to work on my art, I applied to Chapman and not USC.

What does he think about this after he's read our responses?


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 18, 2007)

This is the son in subject (no longer my mother). I highly appreciate all the responses you have all given. 

I'm still in a haze on the whole topic. I had had my heart set on USC, for both the film school and the university. It has always been my first choice. Yet I recognize that the Chapman Film school is very high quality.

Much of my confusion stems from my ultimate goal. Regardless of college I want to end up in the Hollywood system (criticisms and faults of the system aside, it is my goal). From some I've heard graduate school offers the best leg up in this goal, while others have said if I want to make movies I should be doing so now (rather than later). I've come to the conclusion that there is no true, set-in-stone answer to this disagreement.

At the same time I have to consider the whole "college experience". I prefer USC to Chapman simply on the basis of the schools. But, if I attend USC I'll be taking a risk, either in hoping to transfer into the production program or to attend graduate school afterwards (an extremely expensive option, so I'm told). At Chapman I could do production right away, but not necessarily in the environment I desire and with the same 'attitude' (Hollywood based vs Indie based). 

There is ALSO the financial aspect. Chapman will cost me $20,000 per year while USC will cost $30,000.

So, essentially, I have made a full circle around everything discussed, and arrived at the beginning sans-conclusion.

ANY help you can continue to offer would be, again, extremely appreciated.


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## XJames (Mar 19, 2007)

as you said, there's no one path. So if both choices are equally balanced, you have to factor other... factors 

or, you can sit back, relax, close your eyes, and picture yourself in chapman in 2 years, in 4 years... studying film prod... living in Orange... being a Chapmanite... and then picture where you'd be in 5, 6 years.

Then do the same for USC. And figure which thought made you happier.

Sounds like you want hard quantifiable facts. There are none. So stick to gut feelings and emotions.


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## Daniel McLellan (Mar 19, 2007)

I go to Chapman and this is what you have access to as a freshman:
 - Two soundstages
 - Full, free equipment checkouts
 - 4K film scanner
 - 1 40 computer Avid Lab
 - 1 40 computer pro-tools audio lab
 - 30 Avid Suites
 - 10 ADR booths
 - 1 Foley Room
 - 2 Mix rooms
 - 1 400 seat movie theater
 - the ability to mix your film IN said 400 seat movie theater
 - If you are clever the ability to make films with the school's equipment in your first semester.
 - Decent (not great) connections
 - Slightly less talented creative pool than USC (only slightly, and its getting better every semester)
 - Great campus

I would say go to Chapman.  I love it.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 19, 2007)

Wow, you have all been so great with your opinions and advice. I wish we'd found this site earlier! Thanks for helping us wade through this exciting but complicated decision!

Mom of future film student


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 19, 2007)

> - 4K film scanner



Wow.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 19, 2007)

So, to complicate things....

my son just got the invitation to "Saturday at the Square".

I'm assuming that means he got into the Production Program, since that was all he applied to.

What to frickin' do????????????????


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 19, 2007)

Haha. That does complicate things. NYU refuses to confirm it, but those invites to Saturday on the Square are pretty much certain admission.

I'd say Chapman and NYU are very similarly ranked when you sum it all up, but there are lots of differences. Attend the Saturday on the Square event if possible, and you'll get a great tour of Tisch.


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## Winterreverie (Mar 19, 2007)

New York is a different Kind of city. You either love it or hate it. Has he been? Because that might really influence his decision.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 19, 2007)

No, he's not been there yet. We're now talking about making a trip there. We live in Washington State, so it's a long way from home!

We talked to a counselor at USC today. She basically said that students in the Critical Studies program come out of film school with all the same advantages as those in production. She said that many of the classes overlap, and you still make all the same connections. She said that if he felt like he came out lacking in production experience, he could just get an intern possition with a production co. She said not to look at Critical Studies as a second rate program when compaired to Production. He would still come out with 4 short films, experience in writing, producing, and film history.

What do you all think of that?


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## Winterreverie (Mar 19, 2007)

I really like USC if you're looking for an industry education. That's really USC's and AFI's forte. I think visit NYU (I hear a lot of good things) but from what I've heard of your son USC seems like the best bet all around. Plus its so much closer than NYU.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 19, 2007)

I agree. I would prefer he was on the same coast too. And, if he's intersted in making films with bigger budgets, USC is probably best. 

What do you think of what the councelor said about the Critical Studies program. She really pitched it as an amazing program, equal to production. Of course she would only say good things about their program, but it's not like if my son doesn't take the spot it will sit vacant. 
When I asked her how difficult it is to transfer into production, she said that honestly, it is very difficult. That was discouraging. But, she was so confident that he would essentially come out with very similar credentials. She said that Critical Studies was also a very competitive program, with less than 10% acceptance.


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 19, 2007)

I agree with the counselor to the extent that the credentials and some of the classes will be the same, but nothing beats a production degree for experience and artistic development.

When I applied to schools a couple of years ago, I didn't really even realize that "film school" was something separate from any old school with a film department. The few good production programs in the country are nothing short of miraculous, and I'd just be really careful about passing one up.


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## Daniel McLellan (Mar 19, 2007)

I only have experience at Chapman but hey we can always use new people here.

I'm about to approach the Dean with a new curriculum approach that will make the synthesis of classes idea they have been working on more effective.

Basically Chapman will funnel you into the industry if you work hard.  You need to get off your butt and get on some sets on your own initiative otherwise you can just get your A's and disappear into the film student morass.

Downsides to Chapman include a tendency to neglect screenwriting in the production major and a 90 minute drive to LA.


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## Cinematical (Mar 20, 2007)

This is the son (finally decided to just get my own account, this is a great site all around).

TitaniumDoughnut, I was wondering if you might be able to outline what some of the advantages NYU has. If they offer any scholarships (if not, well, NYU isn't cheap) then I will have to seriously consider it

I'm still, against what everyone has said, trying to find reasons to go to USC. I know I shouldn't, but it's a serious byproduct of wanting to go there for so long. 

Yet at the same time I'm coming to see Chapman as a truly great and viable option purely from the standpoint of filmschool.

How good do you all think Chapman's connections, their ability to connect students and grads with interships and the like, will actually be in 4 years? I mean, at the rate you've all suggested its growing...

Also, is it really 90 minutes outside of LA? I visited there on a thursday, but I don't think it was 90 minutes on the way from LA (cant account for the way back...we may have gotten lost....)

Any ideas, thoughts, musings, etc. would be (again) greatly appreciated.


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## Daniel McLellan (Mar 20, 2007)

maybe an hour if traffic is cooperative.

Connections are not Chapman's strongest suit

HOWEVER if you work for it and look into them, they are not that competitive either.  If you just try you'll probably get them.

Internships are far less important than making films which is probably easier to do at Chapman than anywhere else.


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 21, 2007)

NYU does offer scholarships, despite being ranked the second worst school in the country for financial aid. Mine is $9k per year. Not that much, but people report ranges from around $5k to $20k.

NYU has fantastic people, an excellent curriculum, and an environment which favors the self-motivated and allows you to truly excel if you want to. That, and NYC is amazingly nice to filmmakers. You get a blanket permit, and for advanced shoots the city will close streets, give you a police escort, etc. Chapman's got us beat in equipment and facilities, (USC might as well, but I'm guessing only in the production major) but we are the largest film production facility on the eastern seaboard.

By the end of Sight and Sound Film (sophomore year film course) you will know if you really want to direct. 20 films in one semester, in groups of four, shot and edited on 16mm. It's insane.


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## Cinematical (Mar 21, 2007)

I have national merit, and I've heard that NYU's award money for that varies from between $1000 and $25,000. That's quite a range. Money is unfortunately a big factor with NYU.

The main problem is I've never been to New York, so I really have no idea how I feel about the city (I've been told its amazing by a friend who will be going to NYU for acting, but again I've also heard its a love-it-or-hate-it kind of place).

How are the connections at NYU? Is it like Chapman (more the connections you make, rather than just getting them?)

By the way, Daniel McLellan, what year are you in at Chapman? I know somebody who goes there for production (he's a freshman).


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 21, 2007)

> How are the connections at NYU? Is it like Chapman (more the connections you make, rather than just getting them?)



What do you mean exactly? Connections in the film industry always have to be made. But it's easy to make them. You just make sure you get to know a lot of people 

We also have this guy, who brings free advance screenings of almost every movie you might want to see to NYU, often with the directors or writers there. We had Brick, The Fountain, Stranger than Fiction, Zodiac, World Trade Center, 300, Hot Fuzz, etc. It's amazing.

As to the city... I tolerated it for the first year, but now I love it.


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## Cinematical (Mar 21, 2007)

All those advance screenings? That's very nice.

I'm actually not all that sure what I mean by connections. I just know that everybody talks about it and I have a vague idea about it. My concept is "I know this guy and he might be able to help me get a job or internship on this set." I've been told by so many that much of the film industry is 'who you know' (though I'm guessing it's much more than that, aka hard work, your own films, luck...).

What is NYU like just as a university? Campus life? Housing? Student activities? Food? I've heard (I'm saying that a lot) that its more like a New York neighborhood than a traditional college campus, with Washington square park as an unofficial extension. Is this true? How does this affect general college life?


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 21, 2007)

Yeah, it's pretty much like living in an apartment in NYC, and walking between 3 and 10 minutes to class every day (depending on which dorm you live in.) Classes are in big Manhattan buildings all clustered around Washington Square park in a several-block radius, and it is indeed an urban campus. Students are everywhere (on the street, in the shops and cafes, etc) but it's just like living in a big city that happens to be inhabited primarily by college students.

Campus housing is decent, but it's cheaper and better to get an apartment in your second or third year, and many people do. Food sucks (keep in mind, I'm a food snob, and I cook and spend way too much on fancy groceries - most people seem to like the meal plan) and if you have a kitchen in your dorm you can save money and live on better food making your own.

There is no campus life to speak of. The campus is indoors, in the lobbies and common-rooms of the buildings you go to class in - that's where you'll run into people you know and stop t o chat.

It's all quite nice though. I really like it. It's a mix of the real world, and college, with perfect proportions of each.


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## Palm Tree Armada (Mar 21, 2007)

For the record, they also have this:


> We also have this guy, who brings free advance screenings of almost every movie you might want to see to NYU, often with the directors or writers there.



at USC. It's a class taught by Leonard Maltin. Its mostly upperclassmen tho, because its the most popular class on campus.


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## Cinematical (Mar 21, 2007)

I know what class you're talking about (at USC). On my campus tour we had a Critical Studies guy leading us and you mentioned just how popular it is. I really wish I remembered him, he gave us a card that I can't find...

Anyways, I'm pretty sure I'll have to take a trip back down to LA and also one to NYC. I've always like the city, but the closest large metro area around me is Seattle, and that's like a suburb in NYC (a very rainy suburb...)


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## titaniumdoughnut (Mar 21, 2007)

Yeah, but ours isn't a class, and the theater seats around 250 people


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## Cinematical (Mar 21, 2007)

Does Chapman have anything of the like? They do have a very nice theater.

Also, with all the discussion about film facilities, what about USC? Within two years the whole school is being rebuilt and revamped. Wont that rocket it ahead of anywhere else in the country?


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## Cody Brown (Mar 24, 2007)

OK. I couldn't help but chime in. 

First. Congradulations, you have been accepted to America's three top film schools. I would be curious to see your stats. 

I am a freshman at Chapman in the film production program.

My class was the first to claim Knott's studio. It truly is an incredible facility.

When I was applying to colleges, Chapman was not my top school, it was around my 4th. 

I applied to Columbia, NYU, and almost USC (I refused to go through with their ridiculous application). I visited all of them and I new, without any questionable doubt that NYU was the school for me. A lot of my love for NYU had to do with my irrevocable love for NYC, but in so many ways I just knew that it was a school absolutely perfect for me - it matched my mentality.

I was rejected. 

I was more infuriated than crushed when I got the letter. It made sense in some ways, my SAT scores where average and my grades where just OK. My reel was the only thing that I really had going for me. (some resume stuff as well - I'd gotten press in LA Weekly, and a music video of mine premeired on PBS.)

I considered not going to college. I had an internship offer on the table from a really wonderful music video company in Hollywood and that seemed like the better option. 

Chapman accepted me and it was honestly more like a smile and a shrug. However, I eventually decided that it would be silly to put off college when I knew that I would eventually go.

So after a summer working at an office in NYC, I flew to Southern California and entered the Chapman world.

It was exciting the first couple of weeks, just as college should be for any one new to it. The building amazed me(and still does), most of my film classes where very interesting, and I was meeting some very talented people. 

However, everything that I was initially hesitant about, irks I had felt when I visited, seemed to be comming remarkably true. The town that surrounds Chapman is outlandishly stale. For someone who likes big cities, it's miserable. The non-film classes where typically unchallening. Most critically, the main campus at Chapman has an atmopshere more attuned for a hollister advertisement than a liberal arts university. To someone who saw that aspect of college critical to their more creative success, this was really frustrating. There are all to many instances in my classes where I feel like I, and maybe a few other students, are having a conversation with our proffessor about the subject, and other students are just kind of spectators drifting off, and checking their facebook.

The film side really has some interesting things going for it. There was this really unique and wonderful class I took first semester called Art of Story. Every week a different proffesor from the school would give a lecture on how a certain aspect of art tells a story. There where lectures on classical music, poetry, panting, ect. Some were bad, some where outstanding, many interesting. A lot of the other film courses are fairly straightforward but I know that their program is evolving. Hopefully they will really pu together some unique and provacative courses. 

Anyway, those are just a few thoughts on the program. I could say a lot more but I really have to get back to my NYU transfer application. It's due in a couple days.

The only advice that I can really give you is to go on your instincts. If you fell in love with USC on your first visit there is a great chance that this love will live on whether you go there or not. If you go somewhere else you might kick yourself at every flaw you see in the program - this could lead to a really miserable mindset. 

Good luck with your choices, in the end where you go is sort of irrelevent, talent will shine through anywhere. 

-cody

www.codyb.com


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## Cine (Mar 25, 2007)

> Originally posted by Cody Brown:
> OK. I couldn't help but chime in.
> 
> First. Congradulations, you have been accepted to America's three top film schools. I would be curious to see your stats.
> ...



Nice review, thanks for advices. So as I see you weren't so happy during the time in Chapman University


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## KtoI (Mar 25, 2007)

> Originally posted by titaniumdoughnut:
> I don't think a filmmaker would be at all happy in critical studies. A real film program is much more suited for filmmaking. I can't argue that strongly enough.



I hear ya! I got into this one school but not their film program *totally considering change production name to **** film school* and the wanked on me with "you can change your major to film school. It's like bro if I wanted to read about somebody else's film I'd go on imdb.

**still waiting for last rejection letter.**


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## Cinematical (Mar 25, 2007)

Hey, I thought I'd put my stats up for simple review. These are what got me into the three schools (and not USC production).

SAT I:
Reading: 800
Math: 780
Writing: 730
SAT II
Biology: 730
World History: 720

GPA 3.83 (unweighted)
Full IB Diploma Candidate + 2 AP classes (got a 5 in A/B calculus junior year, 5 in IB Spanish, 6 in IB Chemistry)

Extracurriculars/creative stuff:
Shudokan Karate (11 years, achieved 2nd degree black belt), Drama (4 years), Had a published weekly online movie review column (1 year), worked part time for a bit as a pro-videographer, Worked as a community tutor (1 year), Made 3 completed independent films (budgeted and made myself, no school help), wrote a 36 page screenplay, wrote the school play in 9th

Those are the hard stats.

Another thing that must be factored into my decision of which college to choose is that I already own some video equipment. Good stuff too: JVC HD100u, Cartoni Focus System, Senheiser audio mic, and a Mac Pro to edit on, etc.. I will always have access to some good equipment, if not necessarily film quality, but enough that I can experiment and continue to grow. What I'm worried about in passing up a production program is not recieving the instruction.

I talked to a counselor at the Cinema Television school at USC the other day. She made the Critical Studies program sound great. She said that all the contacts and intership oppurtunites, and the diploma, are all the same with CS & production. The main difference is that in CS you can't take the intermeddiate and Advanced prodcution courses. The intermeddiate ones can be filled in with the production electives offered, in which apparently you learn the same things. SO the biggest difference is the Advanced course, which is when the senior projects are made. But, according to her, CS students still have the ability to work on those projects (AD, etc.) as well as work on any other on campus projects, AND get internships. She even said that CS students generally are able to do more internships because they're not occupied with the advanced course.

She also said that once in CS it's much easier to transfer into production becuase you can start to get to know the professors. Coming from her, this sounds very good.

Any thoughts?


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## Palm Tree Armada (Mar 25, 2007)

Damn, cinematical, those are insane! Makes me wonder how I got into usc production when you clearly did a lot more work... I guess they really really liked my essay?

You sound like you've got your heart set on USC. Critical studies be damned, go for it. I personally feel that I learned more in my cinema studies class last year than i did in three years of video production at my school.


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## Cinematical (Mar 25, 2007)

Yeah, I think I stressed too much in my essays how I want to be a director. I've heard they don't like that.

Does anyone know what the school looks at with transfers? It's at the end of sophmore year (for production). Do they look at just college grades, or do they go all the way back to high school?


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## Cinematical (Mar 26, 2007)

I think NYU is out for me. They aren't going to give me nearly enough money to make them a viable option next to Chapman and USC.

So, now it is JUST Chapman and USC...

Should I gamble on trying to transfer into production? I almost got in the first time around, and I'm pretty sure I know what I did wrong (in my essay). Even if I don't get in, Critical Studies is nice...

Oh, the confusion!


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## Winterreverie (Mar 26, 2007)

I'm reading a lot of good things about CHapman. But USC's campus as a whole could have Chapman's for breakfast. I guess it all depends on how much environment means to you.


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## ajadler (Mar 26, 2007)

Cinematical, you don't know if you were very close or very far from getting into production... they don't release that information.

However, in my opinion, based on everything that's been said in this discussion so far, you should go to Chapman, then try to transfer to USC production at the end of sophmore year.


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## mmrempen (Mar 26, 2007)

Actually, ajadler, that's not a bad idea at all. Chapman will let you make your films for the first two years, and then, if you like USC, you can make movies there without having to trudge through the GE requirements. If you do this, you'll have to be extremely careful making sure your credits transfer, or you'll drown in GEs anyway.


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## filmstudentmom (Mar 26, 2007)

Have to pipe in on this one...
As the funder for this education, I think it's important to weigh in the fact that Cinematical has a 1/2 ride scholarship to USC, and $20,000 a year to Chapman. If he goes to Chapman, then transfers to USC, I'm guessing he would not get the scholarship for the 3rd and 4th year at USC. That's a lot of $$.

I say pick a school and stick with it. But, I'm paying for it, so I guess that just makes sense!


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## Cinematical (Mar 27, 2007)

I've been getting told by multiple people in the industry that if one wants to work in hollywood one needs to be near or in hollywood (aka LA) and needs to be focusing on building contacts. This comes from an Oscar winner, a manager at a magor marketing firm, and multiple film school graduates.

Yet, I'm starting to think that if I really want to direct, I should just direct (sorry for my redundant musings, I'm just bouncing ideas).

Anybody know about USC's policy about ownership of films? I think they own any films you make with their equipment, but what about my own equipment? I would assume not...

And to everyone who has contributed to this thread, I'd like to thank you. You've all explained things I had never thought of and have been very helpful.


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## Cine (Mar 28, 2007)

Is Orange County far from LA? Does anybody know?


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## Winterreverie (Mar 28, 2007)

hardly. Like a 30-40 minute drive. Depends on what your looking for. LA the city or LA the concept. The concept includes Burbank, Culver City, Hollywood, Studio City. There are plenty of places in SO Cal to do film and only a few of them are actually in Los Angeles the city.


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## Cine (Mar 28, 2007)

> Originally posted by Winterreverie:
> hardly. Like a 30-40 minute drive. Depends on what your looking for. LA the city or LA the concept. The concept includes Burbank, Culver City, Hollywood, Studio City. There are plenty of places in SO Cal to do film and only a few of them are actually in Los Angeles the city.



30-40 mins drive? That's great. BTW, is there any beaches in OC? Don't think I am dumb ass, I just don't know so much about Orange (my Geography teacher sucks)


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## Winterreverie (Mar 28, 2007)

The thing about CA is that everything is a 30-40 minute drive: Mountians, Beaches, Cities, Suburbs, Amusement Parks, Race tracks, Museums, etc.

Thats kind of our draw.


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## mmrempen (Mar 30, 2007)

Newport beach is 20 minutes away from Chapman! I'm living the OC!

...for better or worse...


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## Cine (Mar 31, 2007)

> Originally posted by mmrempen:
> Newport beach is 20 minutes away from Chapman! I'm living the OC!
> 
> ...for better or worse...



Do you like living in OC? I am just curious about it, because I want to apply to Chapman University.


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## mmrempen (Apr 1, 2007)

Do I like living in the OC...

Let's put it this way. Chapman is built so that you never have to leave campus. For a film student, that suits me fine. Unless I'm going out on location on a film set, I prefer to stay at Chapman. The OC is dirty, traffic-infested, smoggy, not to mention shallow and generally rude, as far as the population goes.

But I wouldn't let this bother you. I don't really have to deal with the OC natives. Chapman is diverse enough - all my friends are from out-of-state. Plus, the weather's always great! I'm just happy to be at the best film school in the country. That said, come graduation, happiness will be the OC in my rear view mirror.


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## Cinematical (Apr 1, 2007)

OK. SO....

Day before yesterday I had finally come to a decision. I was going to USC. I felt that, even in CS, I'd still get a great education in film (which I could round out with many production electives and/or internships and could help on other student films). I would still be able to direct using my own equipment, and I wouldn't be bothered by the school. Plus, many industry people have told me that it really IS all about the connections, and that I should attend USC.

I then also found out that USC is actually givning me $5000 more in scholarships (as well as a $3500 loan) than I had originally expected, which would put it at nearly the same price as Chapman. So that was the clincher.

Or so I thought.

YESTERDAY, I got a notice from Chapman notifying me that in addition to my original scholarship ($20,000) they would be adding an additional $15,000 for National Merit. The rest of the $7500 left to attend (including all fees) would be offered in loans, if desired.

USC will cost (not including loans as financial aid) $24000 a year. Chapman will cost $7500.

Great. So I'm back to square 1.

And no, I shouldn't be complaining. I know that I'm being wracked with a choice that's more of a privilege. I'm just honestly terrified of making the wrong decision, and yet know at the same time that regardless of what decision I make I'll make the best of it and it will help me reach my goal.

BAH to confusion!!!

And that's my rant.

Oh, to the other kid who was wondering about USC Critical Studies vs production, just look back through here. And also, from what I've heard, Critical Studies is still one hell of a program.


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## JPP (Apr 1, 2007)

I am a film student at USC and I just wanted to say that the Critical Studies and Production programs are the same thing. If you want to learn technical skills, fine do production, but that's something you can learn in internships. With critical studies, you learn cultural studies, business and film theory from top-notch professors-something you can't get anywhere else (not to mention the highest paid and most known cinema professor is a Critical Studies professor). As Critical Studies and Production are just two tracks of the same major, students receive the same exact opportunities.

Also, getting into USC is a very big deal, regardless of your major. It is a world-class institution known all over the world and is well on it's way to attaining ivy league status. No disrespect to other schools, but USC is the clear choice. 

Almost every single movie or TV program made has at least one USC alumni in a key position. The Shrine Auditorium (where the Cinema graduation ceremony was held until this year) is right across the street from campus. Everyone in Hollywood knows the USC reputation. In addition to film, USC is known for its top athletic program, school spirit, social life and alumni network. It is overall a great place to be.

And about Orange County, I live here and it's not dirty. It's one of the safest and wealthiest counties in the nation.


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## Film_Jock (Apr 1, 2007)

USC an ivy league?  ROFL???


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## Cine (Apr 2, 2007)

> Originally posted by mmrempen:
> Do I like living in the OC...
> 
> Let's put it this way. Chapman is built so that you never have to leave campus. For a film student, that suits me fine. Unless I'm going out on location on a film set, I prefer to stay at Chapman. The OC is dirty, traffic-infested, smoggy, not to mention shallow and generally rude, as far as the population goes.
> ...



Wow, that's exactly what I needed (I mean your short review of OC). From what I have already read (not only in your post) it really looked like people weren't so positive the location. But I think and I hope you're right, Chapman is one of the best film schools


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## Cinematical (Apr 2, 2007)

So you never have to leave chapman.... But what if you want to? What would you say to the review given earlier (referring to Chapman proper as like a Hollister ad).

And, like it has been said, can't I get the experience I would need and would otherwise get from production just by interning or jumping on other people's films (at USC)?

Actually, what about Chapman. What about the film school? What makes it a great school (as some of you have argued, the best)? SPECIFICALLY, why?


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## mmrempen (Apr 9, 2007)

"What if you want to [leave Chapman]?"

Well, you can. Orange is 20 minutes from everywhere. Traffic is better in Orange than most places, because it's such a "small town" type place.

"What would you say to the Hollister review?"

Yeah, but again, read my above post:
"Chapman is diverse enough - all my friends are from out-of-state."

It's what you make of it.

"can't I get the experience I would need and would otherwise get from production just by interning or jumping on other people's films (at USC)?"

I'm not sure what you're asking. I don't go to USC, so I don't know what opportunities they have, but at Chapman, you get experience from day 1.

"Actually, what about Chapman. What about the film school? What makes it a great school (as some of you have argued, the best)? SPECIFICALLY, why?"

Read my Chapman plug. It outlines all my personal reasons for loving Chapman.


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## Cinematical (Apr 9, 2007)

I think I've decided on USC. Here's why:

While Chapman is great, the film school is great, but I prefer USC for the whole "undergraduate experience" thing. While that isn't necessarily going to help me in my goal, it is an important aspect.

I also think USC is going to allow me more options after I graduate. If I want I can add extra production electives to my CS degree, take internships, crew on other people's films, and make my own, then try working my way up the industry ladder when I get out. Or I could double majore with a business degree (in Cinema-Television, no less), and work my way from there. OR I can attempt to get in to a Production graduate program afterwards (which would not be possible if I went to Chapman). Chapman's film school is amazing, and I think I eventually want to go there, but for grad school.

So that's my current decision. Of course, I've been known to change my mind.


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## mmrempen (Apr 10, 2007)

Well, I'm sure that whatever decision you make you'll be happy with. You're thinking about it a hell of a lot harder that I did, and that's a great thing.

Best of luck, wherever you end up!


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## Cinematical (Apr 10, 2007)

Thanks to everyone who's commented on this thread. I'm very grateful for the time and help you've all given.

Here's to hoping I don't change my mind. Seriously. Haha...


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## Cinematical (Apr 29, 2008)

Wow...I can't believe this was all going on a year ago. Man, how hard this decision was - I'm still so grateful I found this site (seriously, people, appreciate the community here ”” it can save your sanity).

I find it ironic, then, that I might be facing another of these decisions in the future.

Sorry to revive this thread...it just brings back a lot of memories.


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## Cinematical (Jul 26, 2009)

Just wanted to update this thread.

As of July 20th, I am now in the Production track at USC. It took me applying 3 times, a short stint on a wait list, and half a dozen new essays, but I got into the program I always wanted.

Moral of the story: if you *really* want something, and you don't get it, try again; and if that doesn't work, try again. And so on.


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